Deans Marine
General Discussion => Customers Builds => Topic started by: StuartMH on 23 November 2018, 16:39:13
-
Hi there, my name is Stuart and I am new here. The title might confuse so let me explain. My ZULU kit arrived the other day and I hope, at the end of the build to have converted her into GURKHA, but I have been away from model building coming on 30 years so I have some questions if you don't mind.
I have read Joe's thread on his Zulu build, so during the Hull Preparation I spotted some things.
I have the concave hull bottom and will probably go with gluing wood to the bottom. I am assuming the epoxy used had a long cure time to allow time to get things set up before it set. Any offers on which type to use, I can find lots of quick set types but wonder if I can work that fast. That said if I tried the Heat processes mentioned in the article would I still need to glue something to the bottom?
Also found was the mould marks for the bilge keels, the photos on the CD that came with the kit show hulls with and without and nothing in the instructions mentions them, so anyone got thoughts on them? The photos show a complete lack of sonar so I assume that mould mark is just sanded out?
There are a couple of questions on the Rudders. The real thing had 2, the model has 1, from a model point of view would fitting 2 cause problems of any sort?
The instructions say to drill a hole 45mm from the stern but the mould mark is 85mm from the stern. Again, does it matter? Any thoughts.
-
Hi Stuart.
For epoxy there are many different makes from commercial well known brands to generic cheap stuff. Personally I go for the better known ones as in my experience these are longer term better solutions - Devcon is my choice but Gorilla also do one. I opt for the side by side tubes that are easier to squeeze the right amounts of two part. There are different setting/working time formula's - for example 5 minutes working time 30 minutes setting or 30 second setting etc. Personally I go for longer working time just in case I need to adjust things.
As to rudders, using two won't be a problem but I'd discard the white metal one and make two that are identical in size and weight so there isn't any bias on rudder action. I did build Mohawk about 16 year ago and from memory the rudder marking was also out. 85mm seems a long way back from the stern. 45 mm would seem right.
As to sonar I don't recall any sonar marks and never fitted one. I did fit one to a type 12 I built HMS Yarmouth, and that hull - not Deans- had no hull markings at all but I went for a lot of underwater detail on that, stabilisers, etch brass water and pump filter intakes etc etc.
Trust that's some help.
-
Hi there, thanks for the reply.
I think I have the glue sorted, but I had an accident with one of the weights. My feet have not yet got the courage to try again.
I have decided to go with 2 rudders, have roughed them up today. They and the tiller arms will fit under the well I have yet to cut in the stern to house the aft sonar.
Bilge keels and sonar housings will be worked out when I am further on with the hull. Perhaps yes, perhaps no.
Now I have started building again I am feeling the lack of recent practice, so back to the instructions and drawings.
Stuart
-
OK my inexperience is showing through. Having problems getting enough weight to flatten the middle of the hull, might be catching on the sides but I can't take any more off the sides or I will just have a strip down the middle. Will go and think some more on this. ::DD
-
Moving on, so long as the hull stays flat when I remove the weights I will be OK. Leading to the next question, what colour to paint the rudders ? I feel they should be red with the hull bottom but the drawings show them in the black boot top line, any opinions??
-
I've always done mine Hull red oxide.
-
I always use Humbrol matt 73 ... Which is a deep wine red..
-
Hi there, this is harder than I thought it would be. I have relearned the saying “its easy to take more off but harder to put it back on”. Got a bit careless sanding down to the deck level, gone a bit low in places so now I am nervous about bringing down the high points.
Question: I assume you can measure directly from the drawings, eg for the hull width at deck level. Also the hight of deck level, because when I measure the hull against the drawing the front of the bow is 6mm lower than the drawing. Making the Foc'sle look a bit flat. Have I messed up or have I missed something ? I sanded to what I thought was the marked line.
Thanks for the suggestions on paint, however using the Humbrol paint numbers in the instructions it gives the following:
Foc'sle 73 Wine
Weather Decks 76 Uniform green
Sides 128 US Compass Grey
Hull 133 Brown
Had the suggestion of using 73 for the Hull.
As I don't have any of them to try a patch test, anyone care to say whether the rest will look right ?.
-
Id definitely prefer, if it was me, humbrol 73. Same with foredecks and I'd go with 76 weather deck. However I have just used Grey Primer spray for main hull to get a quicker more even paint job in the past - not accurate but passable.
As to plans yes they normally are accurate for measuring against. If you look for radio Joe's HMS Bramble build blog from a few years back on the forum he gives his tips for measuring hull and deck against the plans. Might be helpful to read that and see if it's of use. Well I think it was in his Bramble build as far as my memory goes!!!
-
Thanks for the info on the paint, I am however not quite that far on with the build. Got a bit ahead of myself.
Still working on the hull, quite a bit to re-learn to do about building.
So if I go for bilge keels, should I make then small and in keeping or big and functional ?
Will need to decide soon, going for the sonar well on the stern means I need to get the rudders in and painted so I can get the deck on.
-
Personally, for what it's worth, if it was me I'd go small to scale. The 1/96th type 81 hull is a little beamier and more stable sailing than some of the more slender 1/96th destroyer/frigate models. I never had any issues with stability with mine when sailing, even tight fast turns she kept stable. My D class destroyer, redone as an I class was a little sensitive.
-
Hi there, I am looking for some after the event information. I started making up some of the superstructure parts and I now find my hanger is 10mm short in hight. I am sure I cut to the black printed lines so is there something obvious I missed ????
-
Stuart, is that 10mm short in height when set against the plan? Or short in length against the plan? Either way I'd go with the plan measurements and you should have enough 1mm plastic sheet to recut a new hangar to the plan size. My own habit when building, before glueing is to offer up the parts to the plan to gauge the size is right before glueing. And of course for parts of the superstructure that go over/around openings offer them to the opening to make sure of a snug fit before glueing together. It's better to recut a part that's slightly out than waste time assembling. Usually I've found that the vast majority of the printed parts are very accurate but I have experienced one or two that were not so accurate so it pays to check first.
-
Hi there, thanks for the reply. It was short on hight, about the same hight as the mortar rooms, so perhaps not a full 10mm. A check showed the only structure out by any amount was the hanger. A check of the drawing shows a rake on the main deck, low at the stern and rising slowly to the wardroom break so the front and back of the structures are all different height’s so more work on the hull and deck to get something to measure against.
I need to thing more of scratch building from a kit than just building a kit.
-
Apologies if I get this wrong or tell you what you know as I'm speaking from memory. As far as I recall the 81s had a low slow downward rake from the midships/focsle break so the bases of all the superstructure would not be straight but slightly angled to compensate. And the hangar height is a bit higher above the limbo handling rooms. Might be best to redo the hangar but with extra height at the sides then fettle to the right height/angle once the deck is in place?
-
Out of interest you might like to know that there is a type 12 brass etch sheet available for type 12 frigates. Now I know this is an 81 but it has details on that are common such as limbo handling room projectile doors etc as well as under water bilge inlet covers etc etc. Very good detail.
-
Going backwards again. Now I have to relearn how to air brush. The hull was washed, wet and dry sanded, washed again then wiped down with Meths. The Acrylic paint and thinners was mixed 50/50. Anyone know how many of the small Humbrol paint pots it should take to paint the hull ?
-
personally I would not thin the paint down to 50/50.. more along the lines of 70/30.. but then again I do not thin my Humbrol paint down, I use a paint brush straight out of the Humbrol enamel paint tin.. to do the Hull of my Lis Terkol I used 2 tins.. to do the hull of my inflexible I used 3 tins..
mind you I have not used Acrylic paint yet..! :o
hope this might help.. ::)
-
For Tamiya acrylic paint I use a ratio of 80/20 for airbrushing. Make a test using a toothpick: the drops of paint should come off like a drop of milk. Enamel paint such as Humbrol needs a bit more thinners; I use them for satin black with a ratio of about 60/40 in my airbrush. Hope this helps :)
-
Well I have gone and done it. I have now cut the hole in the transom and deck to fit the sonar well. Now to fit the well assembly all I have to do is, Fit the deck, after I fit the rudders, only after I paint the hull, once fix the air bush. Simple. :smiley1:
-
The rudders/tiller arms will be accessible?
-
No I don't think I will be able to make that work. I would need to make the well,gantry and part of the deck removable,a lot of ways for me to mess it up and lot of places for water to get in. I think I will stick to gluing the whole thing down tight. This means getting it right first time.
Speaking of getting things right what is the opinion on battery charging? A charging socket on the boat or just remove them to charge?
-
As an electrician myself I would suggest remove them because they can get hot. Very hot if something goes wrong with the charger or the batteries. Wouldn't be the first batteries I saw bursting out in flames.
But if you have enough cooling on the boat (either natural flow or forced flow) during charging I don't see a big problem.
Mine are removable.
-
I have both versions on my boats... I would say it depends on the type of battery. .
My lead acid batteries I leave in the boat and charge them..
As for lipos an nicads I would remove them to charge..
-
Hi there, Sorry but Summer got in the way. I have started doing bits to the boat and a photo of progress in included. At this point I have a question, Any suggestions on how the gantry was raised into position for lowering ? The photos I have are not from the best angle and blown up too far play space invaders. I assume there's is a ram on the Fwd end of the well that pushes the gantry up but I can't see it.
I will keep working and see how I get on.
Stuart
-
Hi there, I have not given up but am forced to admit my skill level is not up to standard. I see faults in the pictures I did not see with my eyes. One of the problems was that all my measurements for the sonar gear were guestimates and I now appreciate the proportions are wrong, but I will press on and hope it looks OK on the water.
However if anyone knows about these things I would appreciate any advice on how to produce the fairing for the dive cable, its all curves and I am not sure I am that good.
-
Well I make progress. Its not quite right but Im not doing it again. :smiley1:
-
Still a work in progress.
-
As the saying goes.... slowly but surely. . ^^^
-
Well I cannot believe how long it has taken to get to this point. The Quarter Deck is done, most of the rest is just railings and some fittings, the only thing requiring much work is the main funnel deck. All that is just kit building.
Which beings the question, any suggestions can you make for flight deck netting ? I had a plan but it looks wrong, just too big.
-
Something like that really takes time, but it is a job well done. It looks terrific.
-
Hi
Try beekeepers netting nylon and very fine, hangs well or black roller flyscreen net thin enough to look correct
hope it helps
Ron
-
Stuart,
Check out my HMS Tartar. She came out great and for a small ship - handles and runs great.
I wish I could purchase parts alone for some of my ships, it would help.
Francine